Mhays wrote:Funny - this isn't an issue with vegan friends, or Jewish friends for me - I've found them to be just as big foodies as I am; just a little sideways about it.
I'm kind of creeped out by the suggestion that perhaps food geeks and those with dietary restrictions somehow can't be friends. I'm as obsessed with food -- the full spectrum thereof -- as anybody here, but there are enough issues that divide people... does this really have to be one of them?
I know folks who are vegan/vegetarian/kosher, and I'm not saying I'm anxious to invite them over for dinner
Another excellent point. I know quite a few people with religious or ethical restrictions who would bristle at the suggestion that they weren't food geeks. And they're absolutely right! They may never know the joys of pork fat but that doesn't mean the same enthusiasm isn't there for the rest of the spectrum.
Mike G wrote:I'm kind of creeped out by the suggestion that perhaps food geeks and those with dietary restrictions somehow can't be friends. I'm as obsessed with food -- the full spectrum thereof -- as anybody here, but there are enough issues that divide people... does this really have to be one of them?
I know folks who are vegan/vegetarian/kosher, and I'm not saying I'm anxious to invite them over for dinner
Ah, but there, I think, is a big part of the issue for me. Before kids, one went out in the world and did things. You could relegate food to a secondary role and meet on many other grounds-- culture, career, politics, sports, whatever. After kids, one hosts (or visits) people at home more, feeding them what you make (and sweat over and think about and take pride in), or eating what they think will make a good meal. Even if you do go out, kids have a way of making the subject of food much more immediate and urgent and strategic. Life much more revolves around meeting a dining schedule with food that is acceptable to all, because an unfed, unhappy child quickly changes the tone of any event. So if food's a source of disagreement, it's much more likely to make itself known than it would have in another phase of life-- every few hours, in fact.
Mike G wrote:Yeah, Steve, but sooner or later you have to eat. Won't the tension present itself then (as it doesn't if your friend fails to share your fascination with the underlying ecclesiastical issues in the novels of Trollope, a conflict much less likely to come to the fore)?
stevez wrote:I think the answer to this question revolves around how well rounded of a person you are. If food is your only interest, then you might be in trouble. In my case (and in the case of any number of LTHers that I have met in person), I've got a number of other interests and friends that I relate to on the basis of them. In some cases, food never even enters the conversation.
dmnkly wrote:There are a lot of issues that can get in the way of friendships, but this strikes me as a supremely silly one.
aschie30 wrote:Yeah, I see what you're getting at, and I think you're both being a little unfair and judgmental.
aschie30 wrote:I have anti-foodie friends and eating out with them infuriates me immensely.
stevez wrote:I have friends like that. Normally, our "get together" activity involves going to a concert or a movie. Food is not involved, unless we dicide to go get a bite to eat afterwards. In that case, I'll make my best suggestion and 9 times out of 10, they'll say sure that sounds fine, because food doesn't matter to them one way or the other. Every once in a while, they'll suggest getting a quick bite at the local McBennigan's. Although it doesn't make me happy, I'll go along with the program because my friendship with them is about them and not about my next meal.
aschie30 wrote:I have anti-foodie friends and eating out with them infuriates me immensely. One set in particular, a couple, drove me mad. I don't see them that much anymore because, in part, because eating with them uncovered a lot of larger issues I began to have with their personalities. For example, my friend's wife is Korean-American, and while she doesn't say it, she never wants to eat non-Asian food unless its a hot dog. She pouts if she eats something else and occasionally claims the next day that the non-Asian food made her sick which is, of course, bunk. Consequently, I hated going out to eat with them although they always suggested it. Frankly, I think she's kind of a brat, and this "anti-foodie" issue really brought out the acrid side of her personality. Her husband, on the other hand, is kind of cheap. He wants to go out to every trendy restaurant Phil Vettel just gave 3 stars, but when he does, he's shocked by the price, the food never lives up to his expectation, and he gets belligerent with the servers.
I would suggest that the problem with the couple you describe is not that they're anti-foodie. The problem with them is that they're assholes. Which is not the same thing.
sweetsalty wrote:I would suggest that the problem with the couple you describe is not that they're anti-foodie. The problem with them is that they're assholes. Which is not the same thing.
That is exactly what I was going to say! When people huff and puff and pout their way thru a meal because it's not McDonald's, they're being rude and immature. I can tell you: I'm a vegetarian, and that has never prevented anyone I know from going to any restaurant with me. I can always find something on the menu. People who demand total control over where to go for dinner, who refuse to make the best of a situation, and who continuously comment on other people's food choices (and that goes just as much for "You're a vegetarian? Well that's incredibly stupid" as it does for "EWWW, you're eating meat!") have bad manners. People with bad manners aren't enjoyable company. In those cases, the behavior is more of a symptom of a greater problem.
If it's all Soylent Gray to you on a plate, are you really likely to be jazzed by art, literature, the human comedy in the perverse way that it twangs my funny bone or any other ground on which we can relate? If you have a dour, Calvinistic view of each bite, isn't my Brueghelian bonhomie going to grate on you, earn your disapproval?
kiplog wrote:Friend A is a talented, fascinating person, but couldn't cook an egg if his life depended on it. He knows a bit about wine, and enjoys good food, but it amazes me when I see a smart, competent adult unable to feed him or herself. I find myself bugging them about it, like I'm picking out a character flaw.
Lifelong friend B is infuriatingly picky, he's not an a-hole about ordering or choosing food, but he bugs the bejesus out of me when he quizzes a waitress in a diner like his life depends on the descision. I find myself pressuring him to try different things (he only eats beef). I find it incredibly sad that my friend will live his entire life without the pleasure of eating an oyster or a lobster.
Are these their problems, or mine?
tatterdemalion wrote:Another one of "my problems" is that many folks seem to experience significant anxiety when cooking for food fanatics like us. They think that we're never going to like what they make, or even if we're out a restaurant, I'm going to be the one who is tough to please. I don't complain when I'm at an Applebees if I'm in good company, but sometimes friends feel like it may be tough to accomodate the food fanatic in the group, because they'll always be hyper-critical.