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I've been a fan since it opened. I've put up with the silly reservations policy (no reservations unless your group has at least five members) and the overwhelming popularity which has made it hard to even get in unless you're there before they open. But Lovely Dining Companion has been in Chicago for eighteen months now, so I thought a lunch there was in order (indeed, long overdue).

I was impressed, though not surprised, to see Rick Bayless in the kitchen. He takes his responsibilities there seriously and I have almost always seen him there, regardless of day or time that I've visited. We had this lunch last Friday--the end of the week between Christmas and New Year's--and one could certainly have expected that he'd take that day (or at least the lunch) off. But he was there. And hard at work.

I have found the increasing commercialization of the Frontera empire a bit much. Following Pepin, he has even pressed his daughter into service. Okay. Fine. What matters is the food. I have followed the occasional posts here (and elsewhere) bemoaning the gradual (or worse) decline in quality there. And sadly, this post is to add my voice to those.

Several missteps this time plus what I now consider to be outrageous pricing has finally led me to swear Frontera off, at least until those whose judgment I respect convince me that the tide has changed again.

We ordered two appetizers, two entrees, two desserts. I had coffee, LDC had a soda. Most dishes were good. One (the huaraches appetizer) was very good. The "famous" sopa Azteca was either watery (LDC's view) or salty to the point where I simply could not finish it (my humble opinion).

Small point: I'm used to being asked my choice of tortillas because yes, as a matter of fact, I do care. Egregious error? Hardly. Straw in the wind. Perhaps.

The final straw (to stay with the metaphor) was the prices. Keep in mind that this is lunch at Frontera Grill. Desserts: chocolate pecan pie, $8.25 and crepas con cajeta, $8.75. Lunch for two: nearly $80. EIGHTY DOLLARS! Most entrees are now in the mid-teens. (LDC had tacos al carbon for $15; my enchiladas de mole were $14.75.) A side of frijoles charros (we're talking beans here, folks): $3.50.

A once justifiably famous place that now caters to tourists may be able to get away with this. The place draws them in like flies. The place was packed, as it almost always is. But for me to want to go back again and again, the food needs to be at least (at least!) a notch better. And the prices a notch lower.

Coincidentally, I also was able to introduce LDC to Heaven on Seven last week at the original location. We were very late in the day (2:30 or so), so just made lunch. A destination of likewise solid reputation, I found that it had not slipped at all, and the prices were more reasonable. Excellent food, as always, and generous portions, as always. By way of comparison: chocolate bourbon pecan pie, $4.95.

I don't expect everyone will agree. And it truly grieves me to post this about a place that I've recommended countless times over the years. But I cannot see returning until the empire declines and common sense returns.

Sadly,

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Gypsy Boy

“How can a nation be called great if its bread tastes like kleenex?” (Julia Child)

Well, at least one can still get his chips on sale at Jewel for $2/bag on occasion, well below the other premium brands. And as chips in a bag go, I find them damn good.

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"Strange how potent cheap music is."

Gypsy Boy,

A recent disappointing lunch reinforces Frontera is skewing service and food ever more toward the maddening crowds of tourists and culinary day trippers. Tourists to the left of me, tourists to the right, I was stuck in the middle with salty out of balance Sopa Azteca, duck tacos al carbon that made more of the quackers provenance than flavor, and queso fundito w/short rib that read better than it tasted. The slow cooked short rib lacking the salty, spicy punch necessary to be noticed beyond the rich jack cheese.

Blood orange margarita was the highlight of the meal, tart sweet tang complimented by a pinkish red rim of Jamaica (Hibiscus) and sugar, though, with apologies to KennyZ, I did enjoy the lengthy football cheer, complete with splits, the three attractive Trixies* preformed in the bar area.

Overall I enjoyed lunch, though more on the merits of the energetic crowd, beautifully decorated space, margaritas and pleasant conversation with lunch time companion Pigmon.

Note to Chef Bayless, $2.50 for habanera salsa and $3 for escabeche, no matter they were both quite good, leaves a sour taste in my mouth.

Enjoy,
Gary

*If three designer bag toting semi drunken 25-year-old women doing football cheers in the bar of Frontera Grill at 2pm is not the epitome of Trixie then there is no Easter Bunny

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Sauce on the side, always, implied, axiomatic..........never a doubt, BBQ sauce without.

Low & Slow

According to this piece in the NYT this morning, he takes Sunday and Monday off: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/17/magaz ... ref=slogin

As for the pricing, isn't the $15 taco the norm at Nuevo Mexicano/Latino restaurants nowadays? I'm not condoning this any sense--I had some fab carnitas at Don Pedro yesterday for all of $6--and I haven't been to the Adobe/De La Costa/Cuatro set recently, but I had duck tacos at San Gabriel Cafe in Bannockburn that were $14, and I believe Casa De Isaac's tacos cross the double digit line, don't they? Seems like the inevitable norm these days.

Having said that, I ate at Frontera last fall and don't remember it tasting like it used to--but whatever does?

Gary-

I have to agree. Last winter, I had lunch there on a stolen, snowy Friday afternoon after wrapping up a hellish week at work. The place was mostly empty, and the food coming out of the kitchen was so good - like the old Frontera - that it prompted me to go back again on another Friday afternoon, some months later. That visit was thoroughly disappointing, food-wise, but the ambiance was lively, the drinks good, and all in all, I enjoyed my time there, but it was not, by any stretch, the best Mexican meal I've eaten.

$15 might be the norm but I am here to tell you that I for one will never taste such a thing. For $15 I would far rather spend the gas money and go to Maxwell St. or La Pasadita.

The closest I have come is Sol de Mexico and IIRC the prices were far more reasonable.

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I used to think the brain was the most important part of the body. Then I realized who was telling me that.

I have very mixed feelings about Frontera Grill.

Four of us decided to go to dinner about two months ago on a Saturday night. We arrived at 6pm fully expecting and prepared for a 1.5-hour wait. We were told the wait would be three hours. Ok, so we underestimated the wait - it happens. A lot of people put there name down, but then head elsewhere. We thought there's a good chance it wouldn't really take three hours. So we head to the bar, hoping to have some great cocktails and maybe an appetizer.

To say the bar was packed would be an understatement. I think everyone on the waiting list was at the bar that night. Eventually it became clear that most people standing (including us) had their eye on one of the bar tables. When a group prepared to get up from a table, tensions rose among the people standing around, everyone trying to grab the soon-to-be-free table. After about 45 minutes, we realized we weren't having any fun under these conditions. We left, went to Fado (an Irish pub about a block away), were seated immediately and had a great dinner. About three hours to the minute after we put our name down at Frontera, they called our cell phone to say the table is ready.

More commonly, we save our visits to Frontera for late lunches when we're shopping downtown. The lunchtime waits are long, but not as long as the dinner waits. It's also easier to get a table at the bar. Going for a late lunch makes it even easier to get a table. For dinner, we opt for one of the many other excellent "high end" Mexican restaurants (esp Salpicon and Sol de Mexico).

This is no way to run a business, in my opinion. It's disrespectful to diners. Let me make a reservation and plan out my evening ahead of time.

But, like I said, I have mixed feelings. I greatly enjoy the food. I love the cocktails. I'm glad Frontera exists and is successful. I'm even more grateful that Bayless has had such an enormous influence on the Chicago (and beyond) culinary scene and has helped popularize Mexican food to a larger audience. I've learned a lot about Mexican cooking from Bayless' books and tv shows.

Yes, Frontera is expensive, but perhaps not more expensive than other "higher end" Mexican restaurants. I don't mind the price. Frankly, if Frontera were cheaper, it would be even more difficult to get a table.

Frontera clearly attracts a lot of tourists. But I don't care if the people at the next table live in Chicago, Topeka, or Bejing. As far as I can tell, Frontera don't dumb down the food to attract tourists. Bayless' culinary vision has remained remarkably consistent. But, Frontera has a crowd control problem, so to speak. This isn't caused by the tourists per se - I don't see many tourists at Hopleaf or Spacca Napoli - as much as combination of prices, quality, capacity, and reservation policy.

It's unfair to criticize Bayless (and Pepin) for involving their daughters in their tv shows and businesses. "Press their daughters into service" implies some kind of unwillingness of the part of the daughters as well as something unseemly on the part of the fathers. Bayless and Pepin are incredibly talented people. If we're going to romanticize the idea of a family-run business, why should these guys be held to a different standard?

Yikes. I've never been there. But now I doubt I ever will. These kinds of prices are the signs of the tourista effect. I also don't care who is at the next table, but when they don't have the common sense to know when they are being robbed without the gun and go elsewhere, it's time to say adios.... I don't blame Bayless for cashing in, but that doesn't mean I'll join the flock.

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What if the Hokey Pokey really IS what it's all about?

For those who enjoy Bayless's cuisine but object to the no-reservations policy, you can always make a reservation at Topolobampo next door. Yes, it's a bit more expensive, but primarily at dinner; at lunch, the prices are quite comparable.

There's also been quite an increase in other creative/provincial/upscale Mexican dining options in Chicago in the past few years, throughout the city as well as the suburbs. So Frontera Grill and Topolobampo aren't the only places around. Salpicon is a long-time favorite in Old Town. Adobo Grill recently added a location in Lombard to their Old Town and Wicker Park locations. Flamingo's Seafood in Mount Prospect is spectacular (but getting more crowded as its reputation spreads). Sol de Mexico on the northwest side is okay and has a lot of different moles. The GNR award for Fonda del Mar, on Fullerton, is up for renewal. Xni-Pec is another award winner, turning out Yucatecan cuisine in Cicero. La Casa de Isaac is another GNR winner, in Highwood. Geno Bahena is over at Tepatulco in Lincoln Park. San Gabriel in Bannockburn is run by an alumnus of Adobo Grill. Lupita's is turning out creative specials; reviews are sometimes mixed but I like it a lot. Fuego is doing a fine job in Arlington Heights. Bien Trucha in Geneva is small but highly regarded. Mundial Cocina Mestiza in Pilsen is doing some nice things. Heck, over half of these places weren't even around more than 2-3 years ago. So there are plenty of alternatives, if you want, and more are opening all the time.

All of the above places are in addition to the many more conventional nicer Mexican restaurants throughout the area, as well as your taquerias and other "cheap eats" places.

I've been to Frontera for lunch many times and have found that if I get there between 11:30-11:45, I've rarely have to wait at all. YMMV, of course.

I've been going to Frontera since it opened lo these twenty years ago. Yes, it is crowded. Yes, you can get in if you use some sense about timing. (Don't go on a Saturday. Go early, or late). I just got back from a lunch at Sol de Mexico. For me and my wife it was sixty bucks. That's without dessert. Or even two entrees (we had several appetizers and the heavenly cochinito pibil). Frontera is not out of line with the prices you'll see at Salpicon, Don Juan's or any of half a dozen high-end Mexican places, most of which wouldn't exist without Rick.
I've only been there twice in the last six months, but both times it was superb. Tourists? They've been there since day one. Who cares? If they took reservations, they'd be booked months in advance and subject to the whims of those who don't show up.
And I really object to the characterization that Rick and Deann have somehow "pressed" Lainie into the business. I've known her since she was a tyke, she has a business acumen that would put many pros to shame. Believe me, she wants to be doing what she's doing; if she didn't there's no way they could make her, she's a feisty young lady.
I can only relate what I have experienced, in the hundred or so times I've been there I've only had two disappointing experiences, both curiously enough on Saturdays. Frontera has been a remarkable place for two decades, and to me has shown no signs of slipping.

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trpt2345

I loved it the first time I went there many years ago, but I can't help echoing the opnions that it is not what it once was. I hate the chili relleno scam and the bar scam where they hoof everyone into the bar at opening before seating just to get some extra revenue.

However, from purely a business standpoint, it's gold. As long as people keep stampeding in, why change the formula? Rick Bayless is now a brand, and his focus isn't purely on his restaurant. So if he can get by lowering his quality, charging more for his food, and maximizing his profit, he's going to do it- Just not to me.

What's that?

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What if the Hokey Pokey really IS what it's all about?

Not a scam per se, I guess, but they make an extremely small amount of chili rellenos and they are pretty much gone within the 1st 15 minutes.

A place like that should be making those to order. I don't get it. Are they running out of peppers?

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What if the Hokey Pokey really IS what it's all about?

I have been a fan since I moved to Chicago in 1995. As far as the chile relleno thing, they are best when freshly made and so of course they will run out...Rick would rather have them highest quality then crank them out like big macs. As for the "bar scam" that is only to let customers come in from outside and then orderly fill the tables. If they just "flat-sat" the entire restaurant then service would suffer and everyone's experience would be crap. Also, there is no "extra revenue" as people will buy a drink whether it's at the bar or at the table when they arrive there. Sometimes you need to look at this from the host and servers' side, where I was for about 20 years.

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- Mark

Homer: Are you saying you're never going to eat any animal again? What about bacon? Ham? Pork chops?
Lisa: Dad, those all come from the same animal.
Homer: Heh heh heh. Ooh, yeah, right, Lisa. A wonderful, magical animal.

More than a few years back we used to frequent the Saturday brunch not only for the great huevos dishes but also the leisurely and relaxed atmosphere that could be had at that time slot. Often times the place would be less than half full and never any eyes peering at your table. Of course that was then and this is now. Maybe someone who has been recently, can report if the brunch is still a more unhurried and civilized alternative?

As someone who has absolutely loved Frontera from the day I set foot in Chicago 9 years ago, I'll offer a dissent to the recent negative reviews here. While it's possible that not everything on the menu is stellar (I haven't had the dishes Gwiv mentioned above), my recent visits have yielded nothing but extraordinary results. Bayless's chiles rellenos were a revelation the first time I tried them, and just 2 weeks ago they had the same pillowy texture I admired then, and have yet to see replicated anywhere. The margaritas at Frontera have no rival in Chicago or, for that matter, in any part of Mexico to which I've traveled. The staff (at least in the bar, which is the only place I've ever dined at Frontera) is a terrific combo of friendly, passionate, and knowledgeable - no doubt a reflection of Bayless himself. Time and time again, waiters, waitresses, and bartenders rave about the man and tell me how lucky they are to work with someone who has so much passion for what he does. Every year - in a move of extreme generosity - Bayless closes the restaurant and takes virtually the entire staff on a trip to a new region of Mexico where they learn about the food and culture. Invariably, the menu changes to reflect discoveries that the group has made, and the staff is therefore able to discuss the menu with enthusiasm and knowledge that few places can muster. Count me among the legions of huge Frontera fans.

Hear, hear. Corn smut all around.

Unlike Arun's, which has suffered from the wealth of less expensive, more adventurous and authentic regional Thai restaurants in the city since its inception, I think Bayless has kicked it up a notch, while welcoming and nurturing newcomers from Fonda del Mar to Sol de Mexico.

I had Saturday brunch at Frontera Grill back in May of 07 and I was struck by the relative "mellowness" of the scene. We arrived about 10 minutes before opening and were the first people in line. Over the next few minutes, the line grew but even after the place opened and everyone in line was seated, there were several empty tables. Of course, over the next half-hour, the place -- including the bar -- filled up and there was even a small line for a table by the time we left. Of course, this wasn't too long after Frontera received the Beard Award for Best Restaurant in the US, so that may have had an effect on the crowd.

Frontera is one of those places that I respect but never really crave. I've never had bad food there but sometimes when I eat there, I feel like I'm experiencing a fairly distilled take on the cuisine the place intends to showcase, more than a genuine instance of it.

It's clear that there is a sincere love and appreciation behind what's being served at Frontera but as a diner, at times the food plays out like a well-intentioned homage more than a geunine example of it. It's a relatively costly experience where a diner can feel as if he or she is being held at arm's length from the food they are actually there to enjoy. While one cannot dismiss Frontera's focus on quality ingredients, regional authenticity or traditional preparation methods, it doesn't necessarily seem like the best to place in town to experience them. Instead, the overall dining can feel distant and soulless, especially compared to other local places. Of course, many of those 'other local places' exist specifically because of the trail that Rick Bayless blazed. On that basis, it would be impossible to dismiss the importance of Frontera Grill or its nearly immeasurable influence on the local dining scene. Still, when I crave really great, soul-satisfying Mexican food, Frontera doesn't often come to mind. It's just a bit too precious for me.

=R=

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I just wanna live until I gotta die. I know I ain't perfect but God knows I try. --Todd Snider

Twitter: ronniesuburban

Ronnie,

When you and Gary agree in large part, it's hard to dismiss the opinions - as I think you guys have extremely reliable, well-thought-out ideas about what constitutes great food. Your posts are usually superb predictors of whether or not I'm going to like a place. In this instance, however, we're quite far apart.

I agree with your take that Frontera sometimes lacks the "soul" other places have, but to me that's a reflection more of the largely (but far from completely) non-Mexican staff and the touristy clientele than the food. There are indeed a few places that dish up authentic, perhaps even more "soulful" food in homier settings, and I often crave those places as well.

To me, however, this concept does not render Frontera any less genuine than those other places. In fact, I think Frontera's style is highly reflective of (and, actually, better than) many high-end restaurants in Mexico City. Like a lot of those places, Frontera does indeed distill, as you put it, cuisines from various regions of the country into an oft-changing menu that sometimes adds creative, urban twists to the terrific home cookin' that la abuela does in the countryside. It's different - often better, imo, than la abuela's food. But la abuela herself isn't there, which makes the place feel a little different than some others. Discussions of Mexican authenticity are really difficult, as we're talking about a huge country with much regional variation, and a vast differences between food served in the big city restaurants and that which is served in the countryside. Bayless's restaurant is an original, but it wouldn't be an out-of-place original in urban Mexico.

Regarding foods that are crave-inducing, well... the chiles rellenos, the Tuesday-night birria, the many ceviches, and the perfect margaritas all have powerful dopaminergic effects on my brain.

Kennyz

I've been to the Saturday brunch three or four times and it is a completely different experience than a dinner there. A different menu(dumbed down IMO) and a different clientele. You have tons of tourists and shoppers....I've never seen Rick there at that time.

A few years ago I spent a week in Mexico City and two more weeks traveling throughout central Mexico. I find Frontera Grill to be completely authentic with what my experience was. In fact I found it better than most of the food I had in Mexico. F.G's tortillas are still the best I've ever had.

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i used to milk cows

Frontera also sets aside a few tables a night for advance reservations. I called recently and got a reservation for two people for two weeks later, on a Saturday evening. At the appointed time, off we went, and the food was great. Neither my husband nor I have noticed much of a change at Frontera over the years. The menu continues to include innovative dishes, like a wonderful vegetarian bread soup from Chiapas that we raved over last year.

I suspect that familiarity often decreases the "Wow! factor" and can lead some to feel that just because they're no longer blown away by the novelty, the restaurant must have declined.

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"Our lives are not in the lap of the gods, but in the lap of our cooks." - Lin Yutang

Kenny, I'm genuinely surprised to learn that my comments carry such weight. When I post, I think of my opinion as a single data point in a forum of many -- and many of the other opinions presented here are far more informed and experienced than my own. As for agreeing with Gary, well, even a broken clock is right twice a day. There are plenty of places about which we disagree, too, Smoque being one that immediately comes to mind.

In any case, my feelings about Frontera are not so strong that I would have started a dedicated thread to express them. But, when this thread popped up again, it reminded me of my last couple of experiences at Frontera, which mirrored at least a few of the experiences described here, so I decided to chime in.

Of course we can agree to disagree (after all, we're just talking about our opinions here) but ultimately, the diversity of opinion here is one of the main things that makes LTHForum.com so special. In fact, it's a pleasure to read your comments about Frontera because they reflect such a different perspective than mine. When I do end up there again, which is inevitable, I'll have them in mind and hopefully your continued appreciation for the place -- and the eloquent way in which you expressed it -- will help me appreciate it a bit more than I have over my past couple of visits. Again, I've got nothing but respect for chef Bayless, so in a large sense our perspectives are not as divergent as they might initially appear.

=R=

_________________
I just wanna live until I gotta die. I know I ain't perfect but God knows I try. --Todd Snider

Twitter: ronniesuburban

I wasn't wowed the last time I was at Topo, but not disappointed either. I enjoyed the one time I was at Salpicon more... and my one trip to Xni-Pec (pre-Check, Please) much much more. My regular Mexican place, Monica's in Prospect Heights, makes me happy every time I go.

It's mainly expectations: Topolobampo is more than just high-end Mexican, it's a fine-dining establishment, and thus safe.

I don't think I could ever get my mother to eat at Xni-Pec (maybe if I carried out from there to my brother's house in Berwyn), and probably not Monica's. I don't think I'd entertain clients or business partners at those places either.

Another thing that may actually hurt Frontera/Topo is its authenticity: If it's just the kinds of tacos through steaks I'd find at a dozen little Mex joints around the city, is there a good value? Yes, because it's incorporating pieces of all twelve of those regional shops, a better level of service, proximity to theater, etc. But places like Salpicon, which are doing a little more 'haute', more interpretation, seem fancier.

I can bet I'll end up entertaining someone (relations or business) at Topolobampo in the next half-dozen years, but I have other places I want to explore too.

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What is patriotism, but the love of good things we ate in our childhood?
-- Lin Yutang

A few people compared the taco prices at Frontera to those at their favorite shop. Clearly, Frontera is more expensive, but the question is how much and what do you get for your money. Here is an excerpt from Frontera's menu:



My recollection is that you get enough meat to make about 4 tacos. So, 15/4 means you're talking about roughly $3.75 per taco. They come with the salas, etc. described above and likely use higher quality ingredients than is typical found at the little taco shops.

This isn't to say that the Frontera taco is better, or a better value, than the $1 taco at your favorite place. But is it a rip-off aimed squarely at tourists? Hardly.

(A few also mentioned the $2.50 habanera salsa. Note that this is all-you-can-eat.)

I was just sucking up so that I could get dibs the next time you make a pate for LTH event, or Gary makes his buttermilk chicken

Darren,

I realized the $2.50 habanera salsa is all you can eat, but when I mentioned it in my original post I could not help but make fun of 150,000 Scoville unit hot sauce being the only thing on the menu that was all you can eat. I was negative enough already in my post, and I too have a soft spot for Frontera, so I left it out.

Enjoy,
Gary

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Sauce on the side, always, implied, axiomatic..........never a doubt, BBQ sauce without.

Low & Slow

Good point. Kind of reminds me of the free-if-you-can-finish-it 5 lbs burger.

[quote="chezbrad"]. . . and I believe Casa De Isaac's tacos cross the double digit line, don't they? [/quote]

I just checked my most recent copy of the Casa de Isaac takeout menu and they have a three meat taco plate that's only $7.00. The dish includes rice and black beans. The takeout menu and in-restaurant menus are the same, so there's no lunch menu and a dinner menu. And since have breakfast items, you can order those items all day long too.

My wife and I went there today for lunch. I had a cup of their warming tortilla soup (only $2.00) and their Burrito Campestre - a delicious veggie burrito that only costs $7.00. After the soup, I could only eat half of the burrito and took the rest home for a nice supper tonight.

I've never eaten at Frontera Grill so I can't comment. The near North Side is quite a stretch for us since we live in Highland Park. So Casa de Isaac is our Mexican restaurant of choice since it's only five minutes from home.

The only other time I've had Mexican food similar to that served at CdI was in Mexico. That's obviously much further than downtown Chicago!

Regards,
GP Bob