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Need Some Soup Meat Advice. Shanks Very Much For Your Help

Need Some Soup Meat Advice. Shanks Very Much For Your Help
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  • Need Some Soup Meat Advice. Shanks Very Much For Your Help

    Post #1 - March 7th, 2024, 1:12 pm
    Post #1 - March 7th, 2024, 1:12 pm Post #1 - March 7th, 2024, 1:12 pm
    For about the last decade, the Roadhouse clan has been getting together every winter to make mass quantities of Sweet & Sour Cabbage Borscht following my grandmother's recipe, similar to the version served at The Bagel. We gather at my daughter, abe froeman's house, and cook up between 12-14 gallons, then portion it out and freeze it for use throughout the year.

    Needless to say, S&SCB is a peasant dish from the old country, calling for inexpensive ingredients. Back in my grandmother's day, her meat of choice for making the soup was flanken, part of the short ribs cut. It was cheap, flavorful, and the fat added richness to the soup. Unfortunately, this cut has become rather trendy, causing the price to go up dramatically.

    I've used beef shanks in the last few batches we've made, adding beef neck bones the last couple of years. Lately though, even those prices have gone up. One possible substitute might be pot roast, but I'm not sure if it will impart enough flavor, or if it will achieve the fall apart tenderness desired for this soup.

    Any thoughts or suggestions are appreciated.

    Thanks,
    Buddy
  • Post #2 - March 7th, 2024, 5:13 pm
    Post #2 - March 7th, 2024, 5:13 pm Post #2 - March 7th, 2024, 5:13 pm
    Shanks whether beef, lamb or veal are wondrous pieces of meat that add flavor along with then unique grain structure of the shank. they should always be cooked whole in my opinion.
    I would take myself to Fresh Farms on Touhy and find the Meat Department Head and discuss, short ribs, beef shanks and other cuts for price and availability. Do this early on so they can have the quantity on hand for you when you want it. These types of cuts can sell out quickly.
    I have found the Department heads knowledgable and willing to go the extra mile to give you what you want, cut the way you want.
    Frankly I would go the extra cost and use what your grandmother used! Grandmothers always know best!
    -Richard
  • Post #3 - March 7th, 2024, 5:23 pm
    Post #3 - March 7th, 2024, 5:23 pm Post #3 - March 7th, 2024, 5:23 pm
    BuddyRoadhouse wrote:For about the last decade, the Roadhouse clan has been getting together every winter to make mass quantities of Sweet & Sour Cabbage Borscht following my grandmother's recipe, similar to the version served at The Bagel. We gather at my daughter, abe froeman's house, and cook up between 12-14 gallons, then portion it out and freeze it for use throughout the year.

    Needless to say, S&SCB is a peasant dish from the old country, calling for inexpensive ingredients. Back in my grandmother's day, her meat of choice for making the soup was flanken, part of the short ribs cut. It was cheap, flavorful, and the fat added richness to the soup. Unfortunately, this cut has become rather trendy, causing the price to go up dramatically.

    I've used beef shanks in the last few batches we've made, adding beef neck bones the last couple of years. Lately though, even those prices have gone up. One possible substitute might be pot roast, but I'm not sure if it will impart enough flavor, or if it will achieve the fall apart tenderness desired for this soup.

    Any thoughts or suggestions are appreciated.

    Thanks,
    Buddy

    Hi Buddy,
    I retro engineered my mom’s recipe and ran in once a month at The Standard Club for 10 years. Flanken wasn’t so costly back then. Eight gallons soup du jour was required along with matzo ball/mish/ mash etc…
    Recently, I had a taste for it. Neck bones are in the $4-5 range, knuckle/marrow the same. Shank a bit more and flanken anywhere from 8 to 13. So, five quarts required about $30 in soup meat.
    I don’t have any advice other than this: watch the Carniceria Jimenez weekly ads. They ofter sell slides shank $3-4 a pound and hoard it in your freezer.
    Chuck/pot will be tender enough but without bone, fat and cartilage, the viscosity will likely be weak.

    If you aren’t tasting, you’re not cooking.
    Last edited by Evil Ronnie on March 7th, 2024, 5:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
    If you aren't tasting, you aren't cooking.
  • Post #4 - March 7th, 2024, 5:27 pm
    Post #4 - March 7th, 2024, 5:27 pm Post #4 - March 7th, 2024, 5:27 pm
    Thanks Richard. My dilemma is more about price than availability. We use a fair amount; about 4lbs. per pot with four pots in all.

    I agree, the shanks have delivered some top notch soup both in flavor and texture. OTOH, there's still the occasional hunk of beef that stays tough, even after hours of simmering. Wondering if the pot roast might end up being more consistently tender.

    Buddy
  • Post #5 - March 7th, 2024, 5:33 pm
    Post #5 - March 7th, 2024, 5:33 pm Post #5 - March 7th, 2024, 5:33 pm
    Ronnie,
    Thanks for the tip on Carniceria Jimenez. We've got a bunch of Hispanic grocers here in Des Plaines. I imagine it would be worthwhile to keep an eye on all of them for sales. Shanks, pot roast, and neck bones are all running about $3.99 right now. Not the optimum price, but that may be the best I can do these days.

    The other issue is the freezer storage space. It's a bit limited, so I need to buy the meat close to our cooking date.

    Buddy
  • Post #6 - March 7th, 2024, 7:36 pm
    Post #6 - March 7th, 2024, 7:36 pm Post #6 - March 7th, 2024, 7:36 pm
    Buddy,
    I think I’ll go with Kellogg’s CEO’s recent recommendation and have cereal for dinner from now on…
    If you aren't tasting, you aren't cooking.
  • Post #7 - March 8th, 2024, 7:50 am
    Post #7 - March 8th, 2024, 7:50 am Post #7 - March 8th, 2024, 7:50 am
    I know Joong Boo has bags of frozen beef bones for a couple bucks a lb. There's usually 1 oxtail in each bag but the rest of them don't have tons of meat on them. Maybe a combo of this and chuck roast when it goes on sale at the big box grocery stores?

    Im no expert but I always considered shanks to be a leaner cut. But it shouldn't have any chewy portions in a soup after cooking for awhile. I wonder if it's silverskin causing this
  • Post #8 - March 8th, 2024, 12:07 pm
    Post #8 - March 8th, 2024, 12:07 pm Post #8 - March 8th, 2024, 12:07 pm
    WhyBeeSea wrote:I know Joong Boo has bags of frozen beef bones for a couple bucks a lb. There's usually 1 oxtail in each bag but the rest of them don't have tons of meat on them. Maybe a combo of this and chuck roast when it goes on sale at the big box grocery stores?

    Im no expert but I always considered shanks to be a leaner cut. But it shouldn't have any chewy portions in a soup after cooking for awhile. I wonder if it's silverskin causing this


    IMO, center cut shanks can be lean, but the slices closer to the feet have a perfect blend of meat, fat, bone and collagen.
    If you aren't tasting, you aren't cooking.
  • Post #9 - March 8th, 2024, 12:09 pm
    Post #9 - March 8th, 2024, 12:09 pm Post #9 - March 8th, 2024, 12:09 pm
    I dont get to the the Back of the Yards much anymore. But, when I need lamb or veal neck bones i go to park packing. If you go on a Saturday or Sunday, Swap O Rama Flea Market across the street is running and the street taco vendors up and down 43rd, 42ns, and Marshfield have something for everyone.

    Park Packing
    4107 S Ashland
    773-843-2200
  • Post #10 - March 8th, 2024, 8:41 pm
    Post #10 - March 8th, 2024, 8:41 pm Post #10 - March 8th, 2024, 8:41 pm
    mrbrowncanmoo wrote:I dont get to the the Back of the Yards much anymore. But, when I need lamb or veal neck bones i go to park packing. If you go on a Saturday or Sunday, Swap O Rama Flea Market across the street is running and the street taco vendors up and down 43rd, 42ns, and Marshfield have something for everyone.

    Park Packing
    4107 Ashland
    773-843-2200

    Thumbs up on Park Packing, who have weekly sales. I would definitely call in advance to see what their prices are presently, because it may still be a deal.

    It is the grittier version of Peoria Packing with some uncommon bits available like a pizzle.

    Bring your daughter for the adventure, because it is quite interesting. I once left my Mom in car looking over barrels of pig eyes and other bits. Whole gutted pigs slung over someone's shoulder paraded by. She was very entertained.

    Regards,
    Cathy2
    Cathy2

    "You'll be remembered long after you're dead if you make good gravy, mashed potatoes and biscuits." -- Nathalie Dupree
    Facebook, Twitter, Greater Midwest Foodways,
  • Post #11 - March 8th, 2024, 11:17 pm
    Post #11 - March 8th, 2024, 11:17 pm Post #11 - March 8th, 2024, 11:17 pm
    It looks like a fun field trip, topped off with lunch at Stanley's Tavern on Ashland.

    Thanks to all for the suggestions.
    Buddy
  • Post #12 - March 9th, 2024, 8:47 am
    Post #12 - March 9th, 2024, 8:47 am Post #12 - March 9th, 2024, 8:47 am
    BuddyRoadhouse wrote:It looks like a fun field trip, topped off with lunch at Stanley's Tavern on Ashland.

    Thanks to all for the suggestions.
    Buddy

    Stanley's is good, but closed on weekends. The real treat is weekends as surrounding the Swap O Rama Flea Market are street vendors peddling all sorts of fantastic tacos
  • Post #13 - March 9th, 2024, 11:32 am
    Post #13 - March 9th, 2024, 11:32 am Post #13 - March 9th, 2024, 11:32 am
    I was going to say that Tony's Fresh Markets often have beef shanks for $2.99/lb and by picking thru the pile one can easily find nice ones. But I looked at this week's ad and they are up to $3.99! I still have a few in the freezer that I got at Tony's for $1.99 in 2023!
  • Post #14 - March 9th, 2024, 11:58 am
    Post #14 - March 9th, 2024, 11:58 am Post #14 - March 9th, 2024, 11:58 am
    Note that Tony's ad this week has family pack of sliced beef shank for $3.99/lb. while the lower priced shanks are usually full shanks albeit ones that are sliced for your convenience with the slices lined back up. They are big.
  • Post #15 - March 9th, 2024, 12:02 pm
    Post #15 - March 9th, 2024, 12:02 pm Post #15 - March 9th, 2024, 12:02 pm
    $3.99-$4.49 seems to be the best price available these days for shanks. I'm pretty sure I got them for $2.99 or less when I bought them for last year's batch. I know the price of beef is up, in general, these days. I might just need to bite the bullet and pay the going rate if we want to carry on our tradition.

    Buddy
  • Post #16 - March 11th, 2024, 8:54 am
    Post #16 - March 11th, 2024, 8:54 am Post #16 - March 11th, 2024, 8:54 am
    BuddyRoadhouse wrote:$3.99-$4.49 seems to be the best price available these days for shanks. I'm pretty sure I got them for $2.99 or less when I bought them for last year's batch. I know the price of beef is up, in general, these days. I might just need to bite the bullet and pay the going rate if we want to carry on our tradition.

    Buddy


    Yeah, I honestly have not seen anything much cheaper then $3.99 at least in the last six months or so, and I go to all the places that usually have cheap meat: Tony's, Shop & Save, Cermak Produce, Park Packing. My absolute favorite cut of beef for soup is short rib, so I agree with you there. It definitely has a better texture than shank, which, as you note, can sometimes leave funny little knots that don't quite break down as much. I'm surprised that you found some shank for $2.99/lb last year. I actually feel like the beef prices have slightly come down a bit. I remember paying as much as $5.49/lb for shank in 2022, but I can see it if you happened upon a good sale.

    tjr wrote:I was going to say that Tony's Fresh Markets often have beef shanks for $2.99/lb and by picking thru the pile one can easily find nice ones. But I looked at this week's ad and they are up to $3.99! I still have a few in the freezer that I got at Tony's for $1.99 in 2023!


    WOW! I obviously missed that sale! That is really, really, really cheap, even for 2013 prices.
  • Post #17 - March 12th, 2024, 10:03 am
    Post #17 - March 12th, 2024, 10:03 am Post #17 - March 12th, 2024, 10:03 am
    I have the recipe written in my mother's hand. In my house it was shanks that we'd take out of the soup and put on a plate w/horseradish and some torn black bread w/soft butter. Fwiw, when I worked in Dublin I cooked it @ the Shelbourne to great success. Being in the land of potatoes and cabbage, they loved it (not a stretch).
    "In pursuit of joys untasted"
    from Giuseppe Verdi's La Traviata
  • Post #18 - March 14th, 2024, 8:50 am
    Post #18 - March 14th, 2024, 8:50 am Post #18 - March 14th, 2024, 8:50 am
    FYI…beef shank are $2.99# this week at Tony’s Finer Foods.
    If you aren't tasting, you aren't cooking.
  • Post #19 - March 14th, 2024, 9:00 am
    Post #19 - March 14th, 2024, 9:00 am Post #19 - March 14th, 2024, 9:00 am
    Beef shank is $3.99 pp at Park Packing
    Cathy2

    "You'll be remembered long after you're dead if you make good gravy, mashed potatoes and biscuits." -- Nathalie Dupree
    Facebook, Twitter, Greater Midwest Foodways,
  • Post #20 - March 14th, 2024, 11:10 am
    Post #20 - March 14th, 2024, 11:10 am Post #20 - March 14th, 2024, 11:10 am
    Evil Ronnie wrote:FYI…beef shank are $2.99# this week at Tony’s Finer Foods.


    Literally a day late and a dollar short. I knuckled under yesterday and picked up a bunch of shanks for $3.99/lb., along with some nice, meaty looking neck bones for $2.49/lb.

    Thanks though for the effort.

    All the meat is now sitting in the freezer until the family can get together for our massive soup production.

    Buddy
  • Post #21 - March 14th, 2024, 1:57 pm
    Post #21 - March 14th, 2024, 1:57 pm Post #21 - March 14th, 2024, 1:57 pm
    Note that the Tony's $2.99 price is for a two-day sale on Saturday and Sunday only.
  • Post #22 - March 14th, 2024, 1:59 pm
    Post #22 - March 14th, 2024, 1:59 pm Post #22 - March 14th, 2024, 1:59 pm
    ekreider wrote:Note that the Tony's $2.99 price is for a two-day sale on Saturday and Sunday only.

    Thanks for the clarification!
    If you aren't tasting, you aren't cooking.
  • Post #23 - March 14th, 2024, 2:47 pm
    Post #23 - March 14th, 2024, 2:47 pm Post #23 - March 14th, 2024, 2:47 pm
    Okay, so two days early and a dollar (per pound) short.

    Still very much appreciate the effort, but I think I'm stuck with what I've got.

    Hoping my daughter, abe froeman, figures out how to post pictures here of Sweet & Sour Cabbage Borscht sessions from years past, and the one yet to come.

    Buddy
  • Post #24 - March 14th, 2024, 3:13 pm
    Post #24 - March 14th, 2024, 3:13 pm Post #24 - March 14th, 2024, 3:13 pm
    Woodman's Buffalo Grove yesterday, short ribs were $4.99/lb... but they were a whole slab. If you've got a (clean) bandsaw, it's a huge bargain.
    What is patriotism, but the love of good things we ate in our childhood?
    -- Lin Yutang
  • Post #25 - March 16th, 2024, 6:05 pm
    Post #25 - March 16th, 2024, 6:05 pm Post #25 - March 16th, 2024, 6:05 pm
    Thank you for the tips slid through the lines in this topic. :!:
    As I have scribed, I get the Carneceria Jimenez flyer here in 60641. But you have likely already discerned I do not buy much meat for freezing. You know what is in my outside freezer.
    I set a visual & mental bookmark for when meat shanks go on sale.
    BuddyRoadhouse's remarks about what happens when a specific commodity becomes "trendy" leads my mind to a scenario when somehow bovine feces {marketed as "cowchips"} gets a positive mention in some influencer's missives. The demand (and price) for cowchips escalates into the stratsophere.
    An attempt to illuminate exactly what is cowchips gets shouted down online as "old man paranoia".
    The ballyhoo will last until a credible report of somebody being admitted to a hospital after consuming cowchips. There will be an attempt to shift the blame back upon the patient {"There's something wrong with your system."}, but it will go for naught.

    Somebody out here may roar there is no way this could happen. Some Federal agency will not approve cowchips being declared 'safe' for human consumption.
    I keenly dislike getting political. But I can envision this occurring if a party which dislikes Federal regulation of anything gets into the policy-making seat in 2025.
    Valuable links for survival, without the monetization attempt: https://pqrs-ltd.xyz/bookmark4.html
  • Post #26 - March 17th, 2024, 9:12 pm
    Post #26 - March 17th, 2024, 9:12 pm Post #26 - March 17th, 2024, 9:12 pm
    Finally made it to Tony’s today and the family packs of center cut shank were beautiful @$2.99#. 80/20 ground Chuck @ $2.99 and Oxtails were $7.99.
    If you aren't tasting, you aren't cooking.
  • Post #27 - April 4th, 2024, 12:44 pm
    Post #27 - April 4th, 2024, 12:44 pm Post #27 - April 4th, 2024, 12:44 pm
    In case you missed Pudgy's flyer post, whole beef shank is $1.99/lb at Tony's this week. Family packs are $2.99. Shopping there in the past, it seemed like no big difference in package size between the sliced whole shank and the family size.
  • Post #28 - April 4th, 2024, 1:32 pm
    Post #28 - April 4th, 2024, 1:32 pm Post #28 - April 4th, 2024, 1:32 pm
    Unfortunately, I've already purchased the meat (shanks and beef neck bones) for this year's batch of Sweet & Sour Cabbage Borscht. I'll definitely keep an eye on Tony's in the future. Seems like they run semi-regular specials on shanks.

    Also, FWIW, we'll be making soup--16-18 gallons worth--next week on the 11th. If daughter, abe froeman, can figure out how to post pictures here, you may get a glimpse into the process.

    Thanks to all for their input,
    Buddy
  • Post #29 - April 4th, 2024, 2:45 pm
    Post #29 - April 4th, 2024, 2:45 pm Post #29 - April 4th, 2024, 2:45 pm
    BuddyRoadhouse wrote:Unfortunately, I've already purchased the meat (shanks and beef neck bones) for this year's batch of Sweet & Sour Cabbage Borscht. I'll definitely keep an eye on Tony's in the future. Seems like they run semi-regular specials on shanks.

    Also, FWIW, we'll be making soup--16-18 gallons worth--next week on the 11th. If daughter, abe froeman, can figure out how to post pictures here, you may get a glimpse into the process.

    Thanks to all for their input,
    Buddy


    Have fun, Buddy
    Imagine this: I took over the main kitchen in Loews Anatole Hotel, Dallas many years ago. We supplied daily soup for 8/9 of the hotel’s 12 restaurant kitchens as well as employee cafeteria for 1600. Production saucier made 90 GAL Soup du Jour daily, not to mention a 90 G batch of menudo for SAT cafeteria consumption.
    So much fun. Saucier was accustomed to using the large immersion blender for blended soups, leaving debris in the finished product, but I insisted on a 1 G Waring blender, then a pass through the Chinoise…So evil
    If you aren't tasting, you aren't cooking.
  • Post #30 - April 4th, 2024, 3:42 pm
    Post #30 - April 4th, 2024, 3:42 pm Post #30 - April 4th, 2024, 3:42 pm
    Must be nice to work in a commercial kitchen. We're limited to four burners on a home stove. Still gets the job done.

    Fortunately, S&SCB does not need to be blended, or run through a Chinoise (don't think I'd even want to eat that final product), so that is one last step.

    Buddy

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