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About Tips and Tipping

About Tips and Tipping
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  • Post #121 - October 25th, 2015, 5:41 pm
    Post #121 - October 25th, 2015, 5:41 pm Post #121 - October 25th, 2015, 5:41 pm
    Siun wrote:As the mother of a line cook, I'm mighty glad to see a beginning discussion of the inequity of restaurant wages. I have no trouble tipping but knowing that the BOH gets none of that cash is ridiculous. In Chicago, line cooks at good, high end spots are getting around $12 an hour or so with no benefits and often a bunch of hours off the clock (and folks who cook at Next, etc get less than that). The ones I know can't imagine doing anything else - but can't survive on what they make.http://www.lthforum.com/2015/05/assumptions-ground-up/

    I'm happy too. Ultimately, I suspect this will mean that waitstaff will take somewhat of a hit, but hopefully the fact that some higher end restaurants are going this route means that others will have to do the same to keep quality kitchen staff. But the primary factor in me choosing a restaurant is the food coming out of the kitchen, and I find the disparity in wages between servers and kitchen staff (especially when you consider that cooking is simply far more difficult work) to be very troubling. Service charges included, and no tipping, may not be the complete fix for kitchen wages, but it's a start.
  • Post #122 - September 29th, 2016, 4:24 pm
    Post #122 - September 29th, 2016, 4:24 pm Post #122 - September 29th, 2016, 4:24 pm
    Interesting article. Opens up some new discussions.

    http://resto.newcity.com/2016/09/29/truthabouttippinglaws/
  • Post #123 - September 29th, 2016, 6:59 pm
    Post #123 - September 29th, 2016, 6:59 pm Post #123 - September 29th, 2016, 6:59 pm
    thetrob wrote:Interesting article. Opens up some new discussions.

    http://resto.newcity.com/2016/09/29/truthabouttippinglaws/

    Very interesting, thank you for posting.
    Objects in mirror appear to be losing.
  • Post #124 - September 30th, 2016, 9:03 am
    Post #124 - September 30th, 2016, 9:03 am Post #124 - September 30th, 2016, 9:03 am
    Kman wrote:
    thetrob wrote:Interesting article. Opens up some new discussions.

    http://resto.newcity.com/2016/09/29/truthabouttippinglaws/

    Very interesting, thank you for posting.

    Agreed. Thoughtful, detailed article.
    -Mary
  • Post #125 - October 1st, 2016, 4:51 pm
    Post #125 - October 1st, 2016, 4:51 pm Post #125 - October 1st, 2016, 4:51 pm
    One type of place I prefer the status quo, and would hate to see it change, is restaurants we frequent often, at which we are likely to get the same waitperson again and again. I feel that tipping generously on one visit will pay dividends in the form of attentive service from that service person on subsequent visits.

    I feel the same when staying in a hotel for several days, when I am likely to encounter the same room service waiter, or have the same housekeeper, on a repeated basis. Or when ordering delivery at home, for the same reason.

    I practically always tip generously, whether I expect to see that person again or not. But the expectation that I will see a service person again provides IMO a very rational reason to do it.
    Pithy quote here.
  • Post #126 - July 20th, 2020, 4:06 pm
    Post #126 - July 20th, 2020, 4:06 pm Post #126 - July 20th, 2020, 4:06 pm
    Danny Meyer’s Restaurants Will End Their No-Tipping Policy
    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/20/dini ... ticleShare
    Never order barbecue in a place that also serves quiche - Lewis Grizzard
  • Post #127 - July 20th, 2020, 4:11 pm
    Post #127 - July 20th, 2020, 4:11 pm Post #127 - July 20th, 2020, 4:11 pm
    Listening to an article on marketplace on NPR. They were saying that many restaurants are paying their servers significantly higher wages because that is the only way they could get anyone to come back to work.
  • Post #128 - July 23rd, 2020, 3:41 pm
    Post #128 - July 23rd, 2020, 3:41 pm Post #128 - July 23rd, 2020, 3:41 pm
    lougord99 wrote:Listening to an article on marketplace on NPR. They were saying that many restaurants are paying their servers significantly higher wages because that is the only way they could get anyone to come back to work.


    The $600 per week supplement to unemployment insurance which ends next week has some people making more than what they made while employed.
    Coming to you from Leiper's Fork, TN where we prefer forking to spooning.
  • Post #129 - July 23rd, 2020, 7:04 pm
    Post #129 - July 23rd, 2020, 7:04 pm Post #129 - July 23rd, 2020, 7:04 pm
    True, but that wasn’t the point of the article. When a significant portion of your wage is tips, and you are serving many fewer tables, then your wage goes down. To get people to come back to work restaurants must supplement wages to compensate for fewer tables served.
  • Post #130 - March 8th, 2021, 8:24 pm
    Post #130 - March 8th, 2021, 8:24 pm Post #130 - March 8th, 2021, 8:24 pm
    Restaurant tipping — criticized as unfair and archaic — may be obsolete after the pandemic. Some Chicago restaurants are trying to end the practice.
    https://www.chicagotribune.com/business ... story.html
    Never order barbecue in a place that also serves quiche - Lewis Grizzard
  • Post #131 - September 21st, 2022, 7:32 am
    Post #131 - September 21st, 2022, 7:32 am Post #131 - September 21st, 2022, 7:32 am
    "Equity within the whole restaurant": The problem with the tipped wage

    https://www.salon.com/2022/09/18/equity ... pped-wage/
    Never order barbecue in a place that also serves quiche - Lewis Grizzard
  • Post #132 - September 21st, 2022, 2:33 pm
    Post #132 - September 21st, 2022, 2:33 pm Post #132 - September 21st, 2022, 2:33 pm
    Would be a great idea if all restaurants had the same business model and pricing structure, but they run the gamut from high-end fine dining to casual neighborhood spots to counter-service-only diners. It's a daunting task to try and apply a sea change transformation of a century-old practice across the board. The European model has restaurants actually paying a living wage. That would profoundly impact restaurant pricing here and drive most people away, leading to collapse for many businesses.
  • Post #133 - September 21st, 2022, 2:37 pm
    Post #133 - September 21st, 2022, 2:37 pm Post #133 - September 21st, 2022, 2:37 pm
    spinynorman99 wrote:Would be a great idea if all restaurants had the same business model and pricing structure, but they run the gamut from high-end fine dining to casual neighborhood spots to counter-service-only diners. It's a daunting task to try and apply a sea change transformation of a century-old practice across the board. The European model has restaurants actually paying a living wage. That would profoundly impact restaurant pricing here and drive most people away, leading to collapse for many businesses.

    Some would say "Okay, then. Bring it." No use in perpetuating a model that isn't self-sustaining and/or requires discretionary payments (tips) to make it viable. I'm not necessarily in that camp but I do understand its merits.

    =R=
    Same planet, different world
  • Post #134 - September 21st, 2022, 11:44 pm
    Post #134 - September 21st, 2022, 11:44 pm Post #134 - September 21st, 2022, 11:44 pm
    The companion article "Tipping Breeds Indentured Servitude", or companion screed perhaps, is definitely worth a read: https://www.salon.com/2013/09/09/tippin ... l_partner/

    I'm really unsympathetic to the idea of mandatory percentage service charges vs. simply increasing menu prices by the equivalent percentage. The service charge seems to be deliberately taking advantage of the fact that many people can't estimate (a skill taught in today's elementary math classes, but not in the New Math of my day), especially after a few pre-dinner cocktails at the bar.

    And I'm doubly unsympathetic if, as the article implies, servers expect a substantial voluntary tip on top of the service charge. This is effectively just retaining the existing tip system with higher prices.
  • Post #135 - September 22nd, 2022, 8:01 am
    Post #135 - September 22nd, 2022, 8:01 am Post #135 - September 22nd, 2022, 8:01 am
    tjr wrote:And I'm doubly unsympathetic if, as the article implies, servers expect a substantial voluntary tip on top of the service charge. This is effectively just retaining the existing tip system with higher prices.

    This happened to a friend who took her employees out for a dinner. In advance, the entire cost of the event including tip was agreed with the owner. When the servers presented the bill, it was the agreed amount and lines for the tip. It was clear they expected a tip over and above this agreed amount.

    If I recall this situation correctly, she did not add to this amount. The servers were quite surly thereafter.

    Was it a communication issue between the owner and staff or was she being played? Not really sure on the outcome, because she chose not to comment to the owner.

    I have organized plenty of dinners, where we paid exactly what was agreed upon in advance and not a penny more. Any additions would be dipping into my pocket, which is not something I like doing for a social event.

    Regards,
    Cathy2
    Cathy2

    "You'll be remembered long after you're dead if you make good gravy, mashed potatoes and biscuits." -- Nathalie Dupree
    Facebook, Twitter, Greater Midwest Foodways,
  • Post #136 - September 22nd, 2022, 8:08 am
    Post #136 - September 22nd, 2022, 8:08 am Post #136 - September 22nd, 2022, 8:08 am
    Cathy2 wrote:In advance, the entire cost of the event including tip was agreed with the owner. When the servers presented the bill, it was the agreed amount and lines for the tip.


    Can't address that specific situation but having a line for a tip doesn't mean you have to tip if you've already done so through a negotiated payment. And sometimes people will add a tip for an experience that exceeded their expectations.
  • Post #137 - September 22nd, 2022, 12:44 pm
    Post #137 - September 22nd, 2022, 12:44 pm Post #137 - September 22nd, 2022, 12:44 pm
    spinynorman99 wrote:Can't address that specific situation but having a line for a tip doesn't mean you have to tip if you've already done so through a negotiated payment. And sometimes people will add a tip for an experience that exceeded their expectations.

    The experience was less than expected and forgiven due to labor shortages .

    When she did not add an additional tip, they were actively displeased.

    I wasn't there, I heard about it afterwards.

    Regards,
    Cathy2
    Cathy2

    "You'll be remembered long after you're dead if you make good gravy, mashed potatoes and biscuits." -- Nathalie Dupree
    Facebook, Twitter, Greater Midwest Foodways,
  • Post #138 - September 22nd, 2022, 3:06 pm
    Post #138 - September 22nd, 2022, 3:06 pm Post #138 - September 22nd, 2022, 3:06 pm
    Cathy2 wrote:The experience was less than expected

    Clearly, my comment was about leaving that option open on the receipt.
  • Post #139 - April 16th, 2023, 4:44 pm
    Post #139 - April 16th, 2023, 4:44 pm Post #139 - April 16th, 2023, 4:44 pm
    My wife and I won an in-home dinner with a private chef at a fundraiser. (The chef owns a catering company, so not a restaurant chef coming into our home, for what it’s worth.)

    Any idea on what to tip? I have a rough idea of “fair market” cost because we added two people beyond the original size of the party as stated in the silent auction listing.

    The chef and an assistant will be in our home preparing the food, plating, and serving (so it’s not just a drop off-type thing).

    Any suggestions/experiences anyone can share would be appreciated.
  • Post #140 - April 16th, 2023, 6:32 pm
    Post #140 - April 16th, 2023, 6:32 pm Post #140 - April 16th, 2023, 6:32 pm
    Matt wrote:My wife and I won an in-home dinner with a private chef at a fundraiser. (The chef owns a catering company, so not a restaurant chef coming into our home, for what it’s worth.)

    Any idea on what to tip? I have a rough idea of “fair market” cost because we added two people beyond the original size of the party as stated in the silent auction listing.

    The chef and an assistant will be in our home preparing the food, plating, and serving (so it’s not just a drop off-type thing).

    Any suggestions/experiences anyone can share would be appreciated.


    The chef probably doesn’t expect to get tipped on an item (s)he donated but I’d still do 20% of the value of the meal, including adding on for the extra guests, since there’s someone helping.

    And I know you didn’t ask about this but since you mentioned it, are you donating extra $$ for the extra people? If that hasn’t been discussed, I would offer. The cause may be something meaningful for the person who donated and they might appreciate you contributing an additional amount proportionate to the value of what you already spent for the extra meals.
    "Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit; wisdom is not putting it in a fruit salad." Miles Kington
  • Post #141 - April 16th, 2023, 7:17 pm
    Post #141 - April 16th, 2023, 7:17 pm Post #141 - April 16th, 2023, 7:17 pm
    From today’s CBS Sunday Morning:
    Tips on tipping: When, why, and how much
    https://www.cbsnews.com/news/tips-on-ti ... -how-much/
    Never order barbecue in a place that also serves quiche - Lewis Grizzard
  • Post #142 - April 16th, 2023, 7:30 pm
    Post #142 - April 16th, 2023, 7:30 pm Post #142 - April 16th, 2023, 7:30 pm
    boudreaulicious wrote:
    And I know you didn’t ask about this but since you mentioned it, are you donating extra $$ for the extra people? If that hasn’t been discussed, I would offer. The cause may be something meaningful for the person who donated and they might appreciate you contributing an additional amount proportionate to the value of what you already spent for the extra meals.


    That’s a good thought. We already support the organization outside of this particular fundraiser and will consider adding to our giving incrementally in this amount.
  • Post #143 - August 9th, 2023, 7:08 am
    Post #143 - August 9th, 2023, 7:08 am Post #143 - August 9th, 2023, 7:08 am
    Op-Ed from today's Trib:
    People mostly choose restaurants based on obvious factors, like the quality of the food, the quality of the service and the prices. As restaurant owners, we see this firsthand every day. Atmosphere, location and parking availability may be lesser factors, but the price and the quality of the food and service matter most.

    As the Chicago City Council considers eliminating the law allowing tip-based businesses to factor tips into overall wages, let’s keep these things in mind. If Chicago makes the wrong move, restaurants will close, worker earnings will significantly decline and the quality of service will suffer. Restaurant and bar owners, workers, customers and the city will all lose.

    Restaurant industry economics are notoriously fragile. While the small percentage of high-end restaurants have higher margins, most restaurants are like ours: small, family-owned operations with single-digit margins. We support families and a few dozen employees: teenagers getting their first job, 20-somethings serving beers and mixing drinks, and plenty of moms and dads who are also supporting loved ones.

    Today in Illinois, the median wage of a bartender or server is about $28 per hour with tips. In our restaurants, servers often earn $45 to $50 an hour. Even the lowest earners in the restaurant business get at least the $15 minimum wage because the law requires owners to make up the difference if tips fall short.

    Eliminating tipped wages means the guaranteed, hourly wage for restaurant workers will automatically rise from the current $9.48 to $15.80, a difference of $6.32 per hour. Shifting that cost from tippers to owners has a number of negative consequences.

    First, restaurants will have to raise prices. Food and labor costs are the two most significant line items for a restaurant, accounting for about two-thirds of overall costs. Add in operating costs for occupancy (rent or mortgage), utilities, repairs, maintenance and administration, among others, and the typical restaurant owner is lucky to come away with 3% to 5% of overall sales in profits. On a million-dollar business, that’s just $30,000 to $50,000 per year.

    Basic laws of economics suggest that higher prices will mean fewer customers. Fewer customers means fewer restaurants, fewer restaurant jobs and less economic activity. Even tourism, which is only now approaching pre-pandemic levels, could be affected.

    The tipping system also empowers customers. If they like their server and the service is good, they can overtip. If they don’t like the service, they can undertip. Nobody likes feeling powerless, especially when it comes to spending their own hard-earned money.

    From the point of view of servers and bartenders, the tipping system rewards the hardest workers. They know exactly how to boost tips. Provide great service, be attentive and anticipate a customer’s needs. Customers like to reward outstanding service. And nothing is more demoralizing to hard workers than colleagues who still make the same wage while doing less work.

    In short, the beauty of the tipping system is that the customers have influence, restaurant owners have a little more economic security and the servers make more money.

    Mario Ponce is the owner and operator of Bar Takito (West Loop), Takito Kitchen (Wicker Park) and Takito Street (Lincoln Park). T.J. Callahan is the owner and operator of Farm Bar in Lakeview.
    https://www.chicagotribune.com/opinion/ ... story.html
    Never order barbecue in a place that also serves quiche - Lewis Grizzard
  • Post #144 - September 14th, 2023, 7:25 am
    Post #144 - September 14th, 2023, 7:25 am Post #144 - September 14th, 2023, 7:25 am
    After seeing how operators in Washington, D.C., were walloped by that city’s rollback of the tip credit, the restaurant industry is mobilizing to prevent a repeat in Chicago.

    Mayor Brandon Johnson has set abolishment of the tip credit as a priority for his young administration, which came to power in May 15. A measure to kill the employer break has been publicly endorsed by 26 of Chicago’s 50 alderman, signaling that passage is likely. A final vote on phasing out the credit is expected to be held early next month.

    https://www.restaurantbusinessonline.co ... -escalates
    Never order barbecue in a place that also serves quiche - Lewis Grizzard
  • Post #145 - September 14th, 2023, 8:57 am
    Post #145 - September 14th, 2023, 8:57 am Post #145 - September 14th, 2023, 8:57 am
    If service charges become de rigeur, I'd vote for price transparency regulations so menus would appear something like this:
    All checks will include an 18 percent service charge on food items.
    ...
    Sandwiches:
    Wisconsin Cheeseburger - 1/3 lb, Wisconsin cheddar or Swiss cheese, served with broasted potatoes $15 (with service charge $17.70)
    I'd also want clarification on whether sales tax is calculated pre or post service charge. It shouldn't be, I think, because IL doesn't tax services. That's actually a positive argument for service charges rather than straight increased menu prices.
  • Post #146 - September 14th, 2023, 12:13 pm
    Post #146 - September 14th, 2023, 12:13 pm Post #146 - September 14th, 2023, 12:13 pm
    I found this from an Eater Los Angeles subject, and it has sprouted a Chicago equivalent. It is also on my regular bookmark page.
    Google™ document spreadsheet - Chicago restaurant surcharge list.
    The bristle is when a venue claims the surcharge is for its employees' health care plan, but said employees are not scheduled for enough weekly hours to qualify for the coverage. :evil:
    Valuable links for survival, without the monetization attempt: https://pqrs-ltd.xyz/bookmark4.html
  • Post #147 - September 14th, 2023, 12:22 pm
    Post #147 - September 14th, 2023, 12:22 pm Post #147 - September 14th, 2023, 12:22 pm
    I've always found it interesting how much discourse is generated by tipping policies. I might be in the minority, and I'm knocking anyone that does, but it's never been something I'm that concerned about.

    I'll check the bill to see if a tip is included or not, and then go from there. If I'm not 100% sure, I'll ask the server and that clears things up.
  • Post #148 - September 14th, 2023, 1:00 pm
    Post #148 - September 14th, 2023, 1:00 pm Post #148 - September 14th, 2023, 1:00 pm
    WhyBeeSea wrote:I've always found it interesting how much discourse is generated by tipping policies. I might be in the minority, and I'm knocking anyone that does, but it's never been something I'm that concerned about.

    I'll check the bill to see if a tip is included or not, and then go from there. If I'm not 100% sure, I'll ask the server and that clears things up.

    I'd love for 'the world' to settle on a standard practice and go from there but considering there's no consensus even among those who currently work for tips, that doesn't seem likely. As customer, I know I'm going to cover that cost regardless, and because tipping is such a long-practiced convention, I'll never consider it a hidden cost no matter how it appears or doesn't appear on the bill.

    That said, I'd be quite irritated and concerned if whatever comes next makes it easier for owners/operators to skim from or divert money from any tip pool. This revenue should not flow at the owners' discretion. In the end, the salient part of this is to me is that servers make a living wage. As for how we eventually get there, I'll sit back and let the stakeholders try to work that out.

    =R=
    Same planet, different world
  • Post #149 - September 14th, 2023, 1:03 pm
    Post #149 - September 14th, 2023, 1:03 pm Post #149 - September 14th, 2023, 1:03 pm
    The end of the tipped minimum wage, if/when it comes, may have an impact on this discussion.
    https://chicago.eater.com/2023/9/11/238 ... ation-list
    "All great change in America begins at the dinner table." Ronald Reagan

    http://midwestmaize.wordpress.com
  • Post #150 - September 14th, 2023, 1:11 pm
    Post #150 - September 14th, 2023, 1:11 pm Post #150 - September 14th, 2023, 1:11 pm
    Dave148 wrote:
    After seeing how operators in Washington, D.C., were walloped by that city’s rollback of the tip credit, the restaurant industry is mobilizing to prevent a repeat in Chicago.

    https://www.restaurantbusinessonline.co ... -escalates
    To be clear, this is from an industry news entity that isn't pretending to be neutral. No surprise that it doesn't explain just how exactly DC operators were "walloped"?

    Here's what happened there: In 2022, 74 percent of D.C. voters approved a law that would incrementally phase out the tip credit by raising minimum incrementally until restaurant workers are guaranteed the same minimum wage as everyone else. The first increase, from $5.35 to $6.00, went into effect in May of this year. As far as I can tell, no restaurants were, in fact, walloped.

    This isn't some radical idea. Alaska, California, Minnesota, Montana, Nevada, Oregon and Washington all have statewide laws in place prohibiting tip credits.

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