White Castle: Far Worse Than I’d Imagined

White Castle: Far Worse Than I’d Imagined

White Castle has a significant place in the history of American popular food, and its influence has spread up the food chain to influence many fancier places that now feel obliged to offer “sliders” of Kobe and foie gras.

Last week, I was talking to my oldest daughter, Abigail, and I mentioned that I couldn’t see how anyone could actually “crave” White Castle products.

“When’s the last time you had one,” she asked, with challenge in her voice.

I couldn’t remember the last time I’d had a White Castle hamburger.

So yesterday, coming back from the NRA show and walking along Cermak, I stopped in at a WC (an acronym that now seems presciently accurate).

During the 1980s, I did a lot of consulting work with McDonald’s, and although I rarely eat at McDonald’s, I do admire the Henry Ford-like efficiency of their production-line food delivery system (with many innovations thanks to Oak Parker Ray Kroc, who revolutionized the industry, allowing for truly “fast” food).

At WC, I had ordered two sliders and a small fries – I didn’t time it, but I’d estimate it took more than five minutes to get my order together; there were people at the drive-through, but only one other person in line; at various points in my short visit, two different WC employees people came to get my order and take my money; there seemed no obvious organization to what they were doing.

What I received was two double cheeseburgers and a medium onion rings, but I’d already opened the package, so I just accepted my fate. I didn’t want to wait another five minutes. Unfortunately, I was hungry so I ate one of the double cheeseburgers, though I could only eat one and one-half onion rings.



To say it was bad would not begin to describe this eating experience, and I realize this is not exactly a bulletin to the world, but I had no idea that the sliders were so thoroughly abhorrent.

The meat was grey, and the texture was such that it wasn’t clear if the meat was actually cooked or just tinted: it was very, very soft. So soft and thin, in fact, you could actually bend the patty over without breaking it.

The onion rings were astoundingly free of flavor. I don’t even know how you could drain an onion of taste to the degree that these onion rings were tasteless. They came with “zinger sauce,” which I believe was a type of cheese food product.

I do not believe I’m an abstemious eater, but eating at WC made me feel unclean.

According to the WC website, “White Castle is more than a company. It’s an experience that transcends time, space and sometimes, rational thought.” To that list of things transcended, I’d add “taste.”

I try not to be judgmental (really, I do), but there is something very wrong with you if you crave food like this.

Now, while I was there, a woman came in with a small child and bought a slider for each of them. I found that kind of touching, as it was clear this lady probably didn’t have money for much more. More’s the pity, and I understand, appreciate and weep for people who are left with so few choices about dinner.

But if you have options, and you eat at White Castle, and you’re not falling down drunk or so chemically altered as to be irresponsible for your actions, and if you believe that you crave this crap, seek help.

As for me, well, I’m glad I tried it. I consider eating stuff like this part of a continuing education about food. And as Bruce Willis said in the rather odd movie version of Fast Food Nation, “We all have to eat a little shit from time to time.”

I don't eat them alot, but I love those things. For better or worse, nothing else tastes like a slider, and when you crave one, nothing else will do. I also object to any mini-burger being referred to as a "slider." It is not. A slider doesn't have to be White Castle, but it has to be an ultra-thin patty, it needs to be cooked with the onions, and the bun needs to be squishy and steamed from the onions. The whole bun and fillings sort of melt into a single gluey, oniony mass.

Now I know what I want for lunch.

Huzzah! Finally I find someone who agrees with me.

I purposely ordered the exact meal you received, because for years Mr. Pie told me it was good and a coworker at the time agreed wholeheartedly. I decided it was time that my then 20-something stomach met its first White Castle.

I had to rally through the first burger and I threw away the second. I may have tossed out some of the first, and as you know, these burgers are tiny. I'm pretty sure I was not eating meat. The onion rings were actually delicious, so maybe things have changed or it all depends on the location you go to, or maybe it was all my grading curve. They were covered in that nice crumbly stuff I like best, and it tided me over until I could eat some real food.

Mr. Pie told me White Castle is great when you're drunk and wanting to stave off a hangover. I countered that you would have to be drunk to eat this shite...having had my first real hangover ever quite recently, I would still re-live that than return to White Castle.

Here's another head scratcher for you: we have a friend who, when asked where he wanted to go for his birthday, insisted White Castle would be just dandy. That story makes me sad, yet overjoyed that this was before he knew me.

I've never eaten at White Castle (just never had an occasion to). My understanding is that the sliders are mostly steam-cooked, which would lead to the softer texture (more like the Maid Rite loose meat sandwiches but in a patty form). So if you're expecting a firm, griddled/grilled burger it's not going to be the same.

This is what a slider should be, and fortunately it exists in Fort Wayne, Indiana:

Subject: Ft. Wayne ,Indiana Eating & Shopping recs Wanted

Rene G wrote:

Holly of Uptown wrote:That said, one place you should not miss is Powers Hamburgers, 1402 S. Harrison Street. Been there since forever, and it's open all night (except closes sometime late on Saturday night and is closed Sunday). People often use the term "White Castle" as an aid to describing their product, but that's an injustice.

Powers is a special place, a true classic. I don't much care for White Castle's burgers but I find Powers' version to be exceptionally fine, the best rendition of a slider I've had. Keep in mind Powers is no longer open all night; I think the hours may vary by season and according to the TinCaps' schedule so be sure to check ahead.

Powers is a tiny gem, dwarfed by the Post Office & Court House next door. The day we visited a bicycle race was in progress, cutting off access and greatly annoying the owner.







The menu is compact but extends well beyond hamburgers (though burgers seem to be the preferred order by a wide margin). We got a ringside seat at the counter affording an excellent view of the miniature grill. The burgers begin life as golfball-sized spheres of meat lined up on the griddle. Handfuls of onions are piled on and the burgers get mashed to flatness with a spatula.





After a minute or two they're flipped so the cushion of onion is on the bottom. When caramelization is complete the burger is transferred to a small Aunt Millie bun.





No condiments are added but squirt bottles of mustard and ketchup are available. No pickles and certainly no lettuce or tomato.



I was almost unprepared for how tasty these little guys are, with deep onion flavor. They're surprisingly ungreasy but by no means dry. Really in a different league than any similar burgers I've tried.

Another report, from stevez, can be found in the Chicago to Fort Wayne thread.

Powers Hamburgers
1402 S Harrison St
Fort Wayne IN
260-422-6620

Hi,

One small comment on Powers, don't bother ordering extra onions. Their regular dose is plenty and extra is far too much.

Regards,

Binko wrote:A slider doesn't have to be White Castle.

True, but The Original Slider is registered to WC.

Ooo...that does look like a proper slider. I'll have to check that out next time I'm in the Ft. Wayne area.

In the meanwhile, it's either making them at home or going to White Castle, because nobody else in the area seems to serve something to style.

I understand the slider is not to everybody's tastes. But it is supposed to be a soft, thin, very oniony burger, served on a squishy bun. It will not have edge caramelization/browning. You cannot order it "medium rare" or somesuch nonsense. The joy of that style of burger, to me, is the oozing mix of onion and meat juices when you bite into it, accented with a bit of salt and umami from the beef, a touch of acidity from the pickle, and the squishy-soft pillowy-texture of the bun.

Sorry if this is a repeat - my first did not appear to make it.

I am a fan of White Castle, though I do not get the chance to go there very often. When I do, I have to bring home a "crave case" for the teenager who loves them.

A former co-worker had a heart attack and he was told that the only hamburger he was allowed was WC due to the way they are cooked.

Only once have I had a problem with a WC (very dirty) and I called the corporate office who was very responsive. I was told by someone who lived by that outlet that they actually went in and shut it down for two days to scrub everything down.

David Hammond wrote:

Binko wrote:A slider doesn't have to be White Castle.

True, but The Original Slider is registered to WC.

And so is "the Slyder." But "slider" on its own is fair game.

For those interested, I use this as my blueprint for making slider-style burgers at home. Note his points:

While in most burgers a crisp, well-seared crust is desirable, a slider is different. The griddle is not kept hot enough to impart significant browning. If it were, it'd rapidly burn the onions to a crisp. Thus the flavor advantage ostensibly offered with the traditional method by cooking the beef in direct griddle contact offers no significant benefit. Cooking on a bed of onions, however, imparts significantly more flavor to the meat.

No you can agree or disagree with his tastes and conclusions, but, for what I like in a slider, that's absolutely what I've found to be true.

David,

I believe you forgot the most important ingredient when eating sliders at WC, and that is complete and total drunkenness.

I'll agree on the night and day difference between a WC slider and one from Powers, which I believe I posted about several times.

After reading this post i had to hop in the car and head to White Castle for lunch......

JasonM wrote:After reading this post i had to hop in the car and head to White Castle for lunch......

Then may I refer you to Dr. Roger Lupei: http://il-oak-park.doctors.at/dr/roger- ... ralupeiphd

He's a buddy of mine and may cut you deal.

Did you ever notice that WC does not call the sliders "hamburgers" or "cheese burgers"? Rather when you order one they yell into the microphone "One Castle and two Castles with cheese". In Indy my friends fondly call them "rectum rockets". I do like the onion rings (not the onion nuggets).

Back in my days as a Camp Fire Girl, I earned a bead (the equivalent of a Girl Scout badge) for a presentation I did on fast food hamburgers. I got plain burgers from White Castle, McDonald's, Burger King and Wendy's. Not surprisingly, the plain White Castle burger was rated the worst of the bunch.

Binko does point out what makes a White Castle burger good though:

Binko wrote:But it is supposed to be a soft, thin, very oniony burger, served on a squishy bun. It will not have edge caramelization/browning. You cannot order it "medium rare" or somesuch nonsense. The joy of that style of burger, to me, is the oozing mix of onion and meat juices when you bite into it, accented with a bit of salt and umami from the beef, a touch of acidity from the pickle, and the squishy-soft pillowy-texture of the bun.

My parents liked White Castle so an occasional treat when I was growing up was dinner from White Castle. It helped that a family of five could eat there inexpensively. There is something about a slider that brings back fond memories. Any White Castle sliders consumed in my recent past have been during a night of drinking or the next morning. I can't stomach them any other time.

HI,

I call White Castle's Depression Burgers: if you were not depressed before, you are after.

This steamed quality is similar the loose meat sandwiches at Maid-Rite. Both entities were founded roughly in the same time period. I recall learning the Maid-Rite's steamed qualities were considered healthy. I wonder if this had any influence on the White Castle.

My parents enjoy them for nostalgia purposes.

Regards,

It wasn't until about age 30 that I first ate at White Castle. I had high hopes and it turned out to be one of my biggest food disappointments ever. I've been back maybe 4 or 5 times since and only once did it really hit the spot (that was after hours of "preparation" at the Map Room).

David Hammond wrote:White Castle has a significant place in the history of American popular food, and its influence has spread up the food chain to influence many fancier places that now feel obliged to offer “sliders” of Kobe and foie gras.

I agree but think the importance of White Castle in shaping the way our country eats is generally underappreciated. There's a real argument to be made that the little company out of Wichita invented fast food as we know it today. Selling 'em by the Sack: White Castle and the Creation of American Food by David Hogan presents exactly that argument.

spinynorman99 wrote:I've never eaten at White Castle (just never had an occasion to). My understanding is that the sliders are mostly steam-cooked, which would lead to the softer texture (more like the Maid Rite loose meat sandwiches but in a patty form). So if you're expecting a firm, griddled/grilled burger it's not going to be the same.

As Binko mentioned, sliders are usually cooked on a griddle with onions between the cooking surface and meat. As you can see from this year-old photo, that's how it's done at White Castle. Look closely and you'll see diced onions beneath the uncooked patties.



By the way, the woman running the griddle was highly efficient and a pleasure to watch: not a wasted motion. But not all sliders are cooked exactly that way. If you look at the pictures above from Powers, you'll see their burger first gets seared directly on the griddle, then flipped to caramelize the onions. I suspect that's one of the reasons I like the burgers from Powers so much more than White Castle's.

David Hammond wrote:True, but The Original Slider is registered to WC.

Yes, but White Castle's adoption of the term is relatively recent. Here's an excerpt from a post in the Seeking Sliders… thread.

Rene G wrote:Selling 'em by the Sack: White Castle and the Creation of American Food traces the term back even farther.

David Hogan wrote:After successfully dodging the term slider since the 1930s, White Castle finally embraced it [in the 1990s] and featured it in its advertising but changed the spelling to Slyder for copyright reasons.

After the "burger wars" of the 1970s many giant national corporations were left in ruins but somehow tiny White Castle emerged relatively unscathed. This was a mystery to many business analysts and probably even to the company itself. It became apparent that White Castle catered to a very small but intensely loyal market segment, often compared to a cult. Finally in the 1990s White Castle adopted new advertising tactics that celebrated their differences and appealed directly to their most faithful fans. Following other minorities during this period, they took a formerly derogatory epithet and turned into a term of pride.

exvaxman wrote:A former co-worker had a heart attack and he was told that the only hamburger he was allowed was WC due to the way they are cooked.

I'd ask for a second opinion. A 55g Original Slider from White Castle has 6g of fat (2.5g of that saturated and 0.5g trans fat). A 100g hamburger from McDonald's—not exactly a paragon of healthy eating—has 9g of fat (3.5g saturated and 0.5g trans). Expressed as percentages, that's 10.9% total, 4.5% saturated, 0.9% trans for White Castle versus 9.0% total, 3.5% saturated, 0.5% trans for McDonald's.

I like White Castle - sliders only, no cheese, no sides. The product is not out to impress, but it sounds like you had a far worse than average experience between the botched order and wait time, DH. Not at all encouraging you to give them another shot, though. Hit Powers sometime soon!

I'd ask for a second opinion.

To be honest this was from the 1980's - there was something about steamed as opposed to whatever.

I will say that back them they had real Milk shakes as well. I was able to have a McD's shake when I was for some reason allergic to milk, but WC was deadly.

I did have one of their limited promotion burgers once (spicy WC with jalapeno?) at 2:AM since we were going past on a driving vacation (I like leaving very early in the morning to get through Chicago traffic before it screws up everything) and they were the only 24 hour place next to the Wisconsin highway. I had to pull over due to the illness and let the wife drive. She also has an issue with the chicken rings not tasting good to her.

However, it all being said, given a choice I would go WC before McDs and BK. But the only one I get to rarely visit is well run and very clean.

David Hammond wrote:

JasonM wrote:After reading this post i had to hop in the car and head to White Castle for lunch......

Then may I refer you to Dr. Roger Lupei: http://il-oak-park.doctors.at/dr/roger- ... ralupeiphd

He's a buddy of mine and may cut you deal.

How is White Castle's any more unhealthy than the average meal at Manny's and other places that you post on? Four White Castle hamburgers have less fat and sodium than a pastrami or corned beef sandwich.

jlawrence01 wrote:

David Hammond wrote:

JasonM wrote:After reading this post i had to hop in the car and head to White Castle for lunch......

Then may I refer you to Dr. Roger Lupei: http://il-oak-park.doctors.at/dr/roger- ... ralupeiphd

He's a buddy of mine and may cut you deal.

How is White Castle's any more unhealthy than the average meal at Manny's and other places that you post on? Four White Castle hamburgers have less fat and sodium than a pastrami or corned beef sandwich.

Manny's corned beef and pastrami taste good. WC does not taste good. Could I be more clear?

I didn't raise any health concerns; you did.

I have to admit I like them. Double cheeseburgers, extra pickles, onion rings - I love 'em without reservation or embarrassment

zoid wrote:I have to admit I like them. Double cheeseburgers, extra pickles, onion rings - I love 'em without reservation or embarrassment

Zoid, bro, I wouldn't want you to feel embarrassed or in need of explaining yourself, but my feeling is, and this is a much more extreme position that I'd normally take, that if one finds the flavor of WC to be good, then there's something going on there besides taste. Maybe it's nostalgia or some other psychological factor, but I find it very hard to believe that anyone would actually like the taste of these burgers.

I had this professor, Elder Olson, who was a big smoker. He would smoke throughout class. Said he felt sick if he didn't smoke, "like a fish who can live only in polluted water." I'm not directing this to zoid or anyone else, but I think it's possible that over-exposure to bad things (WC, for instance) can actually make one think they like these things when, in fact, if their senses were recalibrated and cleansed, they would realize that what they were consuming was, indeed, bad.

No offense intended, and apologies in advance if I have rubbed any WC lovers the wrong way. But really, this is some bad shit.

Well, I know it may be a shock to your solipsistic culinary worldview but, yeah, some people like WC's for the taste and even aim to replicate it at home. You know what else I like unironically? Old Style. Yes, 95% of the time I drink microbrews (preferably from the Midwest), but sometimes, an Old Style just hits the right spot. I personally don't understand how people can like Taco Bell, Dominos, or Burger King, or do crazy things like put ketchup on Italian beefs or drown salads in ranch dressing, but, hey, people do seem to actually enjoy it and think it's good. Who am I to say?

David Hammond wrote:

zoid wrote:I have to admit I like them. Double cheeseburgers, extra pickles, onion rings - I love 'em without reservation or embarrassment

Zoid, bro, I wouldn't want you to feel embarrassed or in need of explaining yourself, but my feeling is, and this is a much more extreme position that I'd normally take, that if one finds the flavor of WC to be good, then there's something going on there besides taste. Maybe it's nostalgia or some other psychological factor, but I find it very hard to believe that anyone would actually like the taste of these burgers.

I had this professor, Elder Olson, who was a big smoker. He would smoke throughout class. Said he felt sick if he didn't smoke, "like a fish who can live only in polluted water." I'm not directing this to zoid or anyone else, but I think it's possible that over-exposure to bad things (WC, for instance) can actually make one think they like these things when, in fact, if their senses were recalibrated and cleansed, they would realize that what they were consuming was, indeed, bad.

No offense intended, and apologies in advance if I have rubbed any WC lovers the wrong way. But really, this is some bad shit.

No offense taken Hammond. I'm never ever going to appreciate eyeball tacos, chitlins, cicadas, vegemite, or a dozen other things - we all have our own limits.

David Hammond wrote:

zoid wrote:I have to admit I like them. Double cheeseburgers, extra pickles, onion rings - I love 'em without reservation or embarrassment

Zoid, bro, I wouldn't want you to feel embarrassed or in need of explaining yourself, but my feeling is, and this is a much more extreme position that I'd normally take, that if one finds the flavor of WC to be good, then there's something going on there besides taste. Maybe it's nostalgia or some other psychological factor, but I find it very hard to believe that anyone would actually like the taste of these burgers.

I had this professor, Elder Olson, who was a big smoker. He would smoke throughout class. Said he felt sick if he didn't smoke, "like a fish who can live only in polluted water." I'm not directing this to zoid or anyone else, but I think it's possible that over-exposure to bad things (WC, for instance) can actually make one think they like these things when, in fact, if their senses were recalibrated and cleansed, they would realize that what they were consuming was, indeed, bad.

No offense intended, and apologies in advance if I have rubbed any WC lovers the wrong way. But really, this is some bad shit.

This is like "people are reporting my posts in the no reservations policy thread because I'm insulting and offending them so I'll stop" levels of idiocy. When will someone report your posts so you just stop? We get it, you don't like them, and you think something is wrong with people who do.

I don't think it's fair to compare Old Style (a drinkable if undistinguished beer) with a WC "hamburger," which I will put right up there with the top three bad tastes of the last ten years. You like WC? Fine. We're at an impasse.

zoid wrote:

David Hammond wrote:

zoid wrote:I have to admit I like them. Double cheeseburgers, extra pickles, onion rings - I love 'em without reservation or embarrassment

Zoid, bro, I wouldn't want you to feel embarrassed or in need of explaining yourself, but my feeling is, and this is a much more extreme position that I'd normally take, that if one finds the flavor of WC to be good, then there's something going on there besides taste. Maybe it's nostalgia or some other psychological factor, but I find it very hard to believe that anyone would actually like the taste of these burgers.

I had this professor, Elder Olson, who was a big smoker. He would smoke throughout class. Said he felt sick if he didn't smoke, "like a fish who can live only in polluted water." I'm not directing this to zoid or anyone else, but I think it's possible that over-exposure to bad things (WC, for instance) can actually make one think they like these things when, in fact, if their senses were recalibrated and cleansed, they would realize that what they were consuming was, indeed, bad.

No offense intended, and apologies in advance if I have rubbed any WC lovers the wrong way. But really, this is some bad shit.

No offense taken Hammond. I'm never ever going to appreciate eyeball tacos, chitlins, cicadas, vegemite, or a dozen other things - we all have our own limits.

Eyeball tacos would also make the top three bad tastes of the past 10 years.

Chitlins, on the other hand, actually get better with age (as my taste buds wither and become less sensitive).

TCK wrote:

David Hammond wrote:

zoid wrote:I have to admit I like them. Double cheeseburgers, extra pickles, onion rings - I love 'em without reservation or embarrassment

Zoid, bro, I wouldn't want you to feel embarrassed or in need of explaining yourself, but my feeling is, and this is a much more extreme position that I'd normally take, that if one finds the flavor of WC to be good, then there's something going on there besides taste. Maybe it's nostalgia or some other psychological factor, but I find it very hard to believe that anyone would actually like the taste of these burgers.

I had this professor, Elder Olson, who was a big smoker. He would smoke throughout class. Said he felt sick if he didn't smoke, "like a fish who can live only in polluted water." I'm not directing this to zoid or anyone else, but I think it's possible that over-exposure to bad things (WC, for instance) can actually make one think they like these things when, in fact, if their senses were recalibrated and cleansed, they would realize that what they were consuming was, indeed, bad.

No offense intended, and apologies in advance if I have rubbed any WC lovers the wrong way. But really, this is some bad shit.

This is like "people are reporting my posts in the no reservations policy thread because I'm insulting and offending them so I'll stop" levels of idiocy. When will someone report your posts so you just stop? We get it, you don't like them, and you think something is wrong with people who do.

One thing people never seem to get, but it was clear since the day we founded this forum, is that conversations may proceed that do not interest everyone. The solution: don't read threads if they don't interest you. If people wish to continue the conversation, they may do so, no harm. If you're bored, go elsewhere. It's not complicated.

David Hammond wrote:I don't think it's fair to compare Old Style (a drinkable if undistinguished beer) with a WC "hamburger," which I will put right up there with the top three bad tastes of the last ten years. You like WC? Fine. We're at an impasse.

Nobody's trying to get you to like them, so I don't see what the impasse could possibly be, unless you are really being serious and not being a hyperbolic smart-ass about not understanding the concept of subjective taste. Somehow, I doubt that.