Interesting discussion tonight. For what it's worth, here are a few hints and observations from someone with literally thousands of batches of veal stock/demi under his size 54 belt. I've seen first hand, every way in which to possibly destroy a 200 pound batch of veal stock, and along the way, figured out the right way to get the job done. Chefs Cantu and GEB or anyone else out there, I'd love to hear if your thoughts differ from mine. I'm strictly an old timer.
Steve: I've never heard of beef demi glace or seen a recipe for it anywhere. Your government issue demi is made from veal bones.
Cathy: my guess is that the first person in at Trotters the next morning strains and reduces that brown veal stock. There is nothing like cooking a stock too long to ensure a bitter end result. The CIA teaches 10 to 12 hours and I agree with that.
jlawrence: I agree that Minor's, Knorr, or any of the big names make decent bases, which, when used as an enhancement to, rather than a replacement for a fresh stock, are economical and tasty products, and there is a place for them in today's commercial or even home kitchen. Manny's coffee shop couldn't turn out such great short ribs, smothered steak, or stews, without a little hit of beef base, and maybe a drop of kitchen bouquet too. I guarantee they aren't buying demi glace gold. FYI: I worked in the kitchen of the historic Hotel Adolphus in Dallas in the eighties, where Jean Banchet was our consulting chef to the hotel's French Room, and I've seen him using Minor's lobster base along with plenty of lobster bodies, to enhance his lobster bisque.
Ed: The amount of reduction used for the demi glace gold product, produces no negative taste whatsoever. It is simply more concentrated. I can see where using too much of it could be pretty disgusting, but used with restraint, I see no problem.
For the club's demi, I buy veal shank end bones from Provimi (at a premium). These are the ends from their portion controlled osso buco which have more meat and cartilage than your standard leg or shoulder bones. We do this once and sometimes twice a week, every week of the year. For a 200 lb. batch of bones, we use 50 lbs of mirepoix and cover with chicken stock rather than water. The 200 pounds of bones and 40 gallons or so of chicken stock yields about eight gallons of demi at a cost of about a buck an ounce (for product alone). I use chicken stock for all of my stocks, fish and lobster included.
Ive been taught that the use of too many onion skins and or celery leaves will produce a bitter stock and I agree.
Skim constantly for the first few hours, and often for the remaining of the cooking time, for a clearer end result.
By the way Steve, that stew looks superb! I needed something comforting tonight also, and made turkey and dumplin's.
Last edited by
Evil Ronnie on February 28th, 2005, 11:40 pm, edited 6 times in total.